Transcript:

Melinda Allen-Grote (00:01): Today is May 23, 2024. I am Melinda Allen-Grote, and I am here with Mrs. Helen Thorpe at her house in Ocean Grove. And we are recording her memories for the Historical Society of Ocean Grove. So thank you so much for agreeing to be a participant in our project.

Helen Thorpe: You're welcome.

Melinda: (00:25) So let's just start at the beginning. So tell me a little bit about your history in Ocean Grove.

Helen: All right. Well, I didn't really remember for a while when I first came, but I have a picture of myself with my mother when I was one, so. And I was obviously on the beach, so I thought, oh, I didn't realize I'd been coming that long. But we had a tent.

Melinda: So that would have been 1930ish.

Helen: Yeah, 29, 30s. [M: Okay] And we had a tent that went way back with my grandfather, and he was a good friend of Stokes. In fact, my mother told me that they used to play cards together in our tent.

Melinda: What was your grandfather's name?

Helen: Franklin Buch. B U C H….I think it's Franklin.

Melinda: Okay.

Helen: There were... I sometimes mix up the father and grandfather.

Melinda: Okay.

Helen: But anyway, so we were in. When I first started coming, we went to the tent, and we had that tent until 1988, I think.

Melinda: Oh, my goodness.

Helen: From about 1900,

Melinda: Almost 100 years.

Helen: Yeah… But my mother was alone then [1988] , and she. There was no air conditioning, and her best friend had left, and so she decided it was time to give it up. And I had this house at that time, so we had to give up our tent. My grandfather had added many rooms to it, so it was the largest and still is probably the largest tent. We had a big room that was a dining room and another little room off that, plus a bathroom that the toilet was in. Had a closed door inside the bathroom, and then a fairly large kitchen compared to some of my friends in tents. And another room that he had added on the back of that. The Wills have that tent now. And they took that back room off. Maybe it saved money, I don't know. But anyway, so I remember my mother and her sister started coming here and bringing their family. I grew up with my cousin Joan, and I mean, we were like sisters. We were here every summer from the time we were. I was five, she'd be three until I was maybe, I think, 21. When I finished college, I started work and couldn't come down.

Helen: Joan, my cousin, was married to Tom Shotwell, Marilyn's brother in law.

Melinda: Okay.

Helen: Many people don't know Tom because he and Joan were married for 15 years, and he was hit by a car and died on their 15th wedding anniversary.

Melinda: Oh, boy.

Helen: It was tragic. He was only 35.

Melinda: Wow.

Helen: Yeah, that was a sad thing.

Melinda: Tell me some of the memories you have of being here as a teenager. So that was in the 30s and 40s.

Helen: I have a lot of pictures of me in bathing suits on the beach. They had a news article in the Ocean Grove Times every week that was written about the teenagers, and somebody was writing about who was dating who and who was going with who and all of that. And so a lot of the pictures I have are of that. I do have a picture, too, that is interesting. It is of my cousin Joan and Tom Shotwell and myself and Phil Thorpe. Joan and I married those two, and that was when we were both. I would think if I was 21. She was 19. She was married when she was 20, so.

Melinda: And Jim Thorpe was also from here.

Helen: No, Phil Thorpe.

Melinda: Oh, Phil Thorpe. Okay.

Helen: Phil and his brother Harold were. What do they call them? They worked at the hotel. They got the.... Bellhops. And their father. I don't remember his first name, just slipped my mind. Anyway, he and Tom Shotwell's father were roommates at Yale. And that's how the Thorpes came to Ocean Grove. They came down for a month and stayed at the hotel. But in the meantime, their two sons had been working here. So that's how that family got pulled together. And I remember my memories of a child in Ocean Grove were running around on Sunday when there were no cars. We loved it because we could run around in the streets and ride bikes and not have to think about it. That part was great. I do remember as we got to be teenagers, we went to... We walked to Bradley Beach. Our parents would say, okay. We'd come back from the auditorium and we'd say, we want to go to the beach. Okay, go. I don't think they had badges or any charge for the beach back in those days, so. But we used to... Our mothers, when we were young, used to walk us up to the boardwalk.

Helen: And they'd be all dressed up. We'd be dressed up. Heaven forbid you go to the boardwalk without being dressed. And they would take us down the boardwalk, down Ocean Pathway, down towards the hotel, around and back to the Merry Go Round. And we would get two rides on the Merry Go Round each night. And then we'd walk home and they'd put us to bed, But. And the other. I remember doing that for years. And then as kids, we used to just go down the boardwalk. We grew meet friends and do. And then Joan and I worked when we were teenagers. She was probably 13. I was 15. At the Macaroon shop when it was in. Under the hotel.

Melinda: Where was the hotel?

Helen: At the north end, where the big empty lot is. That was where the hotel was. It had a movie theater in one end. Even I think after the hotel was not used as a hotel, but it had. There were a bunch of stuff stores very similar to the Paramount up there. Where there stores on both sides. That's exactly what was under the hotel at North End. We were at one end, the Ocean Grove end. The macaroon shop was. And there was. I remember they sold orange juice at this one place. It was so cold. It gave you a headache.

Melinda: A brain freeze.

Helen: Brain freeze. When things would be that cold, there was somebody who drew pictures of you. There was a scale. People would get weighed. And then there were games. And at one point there was a little. Where the Merry Ground is Carousel at one end. In front of it was a... You rode little cars in and around a great big circle. It was very busy. And it would be fun to have that same thing there now.[M: Right]. It really would be great. But it would be a big attraction.

Melinda: You stopped coming for the summers when you graduated college..

Helen: Yes I did because I went, I was going to, when I graduated college I decided I didn't want…. I was a phys ed major, I did not want to be, [to] teach phys ed. And I took a class in, we had to have a lot of science. And one of them was kinesiology. I thought this was the greatest thing. I loved that course. So that put me into physical therapy. So I went from college to graduate hospital in Philadelphia for a year to become a physical therapist. Then I worked in the city for the VNA for three years in the city of Philadelphia.

Melinda: And what brought you back to Ocean Grove?

Helen: Well, my parents were coming all the time anyway. And my aunt and uncle, I think, came. And Joan, if she was, but Joan was not near. She married Tom They had a baby. They lived in Chicago. Then they moved to Boston, I think, before they ended up in Pennsylvania sometimes. So they weren't coming. They may have come later when their kids got a little older. They came back to the Grove.

Melinda: When did you finally settle here?

Helen: In 1979, we bought the house. But I did not move here until 2003. I would come down. I was working, so I would come weekends, all summer. And even when I retired, I would come then from May to October. But we had, it was an old house. And the heat would keep going out. And I thought... It's the dryer, sorry. Anyway, I came for summers, but by October I left. Because it was not that comfortable here. But then finally in two thousand three or four, I decided I could not keep two houses in Chatham and then here and I knew my kids would not come visit in Chatham so and that was a townhouse that I only had two bedrooms. So I decided, I think I'll move to the shore. And then the reason is a lot of my friends up there had moved and I could walk here for everything. All my friends, even now, we all talk about the fact, the one thing we love is we can walk everywhere. We can walk to each other's homes. We can get something at the stores. We can go to the post office, banks, everything we need. And now, of course, all my family love coming here.

Melinda: It's a blessing.

Helen: Yeah.

Melinda: Tell me a little bit about what the tent community was like in the 30s during the summer.

H: Oh, there were a bunch of children. The tents were filled with families back then. And we had friends all over. And we would play games at night, like hide and seek. We would do things together. We sat on the beach as a group of teenagers. We chatted just a bunch of things, like normal. And we would be in and out of each other's tents, like they were our own. I remember this one guy used to come in through the kitchen and say, hi, I just wanted to know if you'd gone to the beach today. And I'd say, you couldn't go out and knock on the door? But anyway, my friend Lois McCormick had a tent for a good many years. They moved her out a couple years ago. But she would comment now… There are very few kids, very few families. A lot of older people or people who work and just come down, they're weekend people. Whereas we were families. The mothers were here. The husbands came for the weekend. They came for their vacation. But basically, it was just kids and parents. It was a camp for kids for the summer. It was. It was great. I'd go home and people would say, oh, I had the best time at camp. And I said, I had the best time at the shore. I didn't have any rules and regulations except for my parents. [Right]. But, no, there were a bunch of kids. And we all would gather on the beach.

Melinda: Do you know what the history was that brought your grandfather here?

Helen: I don't really know that. But I do. Because I don't think of them as being very religious to have followed or wanted to come to a place like Ocean Grove. But I know they were here for a long time before 1900. My mother used to say it would take them from Philadelphia, it would take them three days to get to Ocean Grove, because they would come by horse and buggy, and they'd go from Philadelphia to Trenton, and Trenton to Hightstown, and from Hightstown to Ocean Grove.

Melinda: That's so interesting. And so where did they leave their horse and buggy? Do you have any idea?

Helen: I don't know, but there are, if you look,

Melinda: Right, they're stations.

Helen: Yes, there are places.

Melinda: Posts, right.

Helen: And they were along Main Street. Back there were, I think, some stables, barns, things. None of those were houses or buildings except for the school.

Melinda: So your grandparents weren't part of the Methodist community as far as you know.

Helen: I don't think so. My father did not even go to church. I was the one that went to church. And I didn't go to a Methodist church. I went to a Presbyterian because my friends all went there.

Melinda: Your friends from here or from home?

Helen: From home.

Melinda: And then during the summer, when you were here as a child, did people go to the auditorium for church?

Helen: My mother did. [M:Okay.] And my father, I think. They went. And I went all through the chapel, Thornley Chapel. I mean, we learned a song, Genesis 6 of the Leviticus number. You know, all that. And then we would stay there. My cousin was two years younger. But what I did, she did. You had to be 12 to go over to the youth center. So when I was 12, I went. Joan came too, even though she was 10. Where I went, she went.

Melinda: Do you remember being here with your grandparents?

Helen: No. No. I really don't. On my father's side, which this is on my father's side, I never met my grandmother. [Okay] She died before I was born. My grandfather lived with us. And at one point, I used to have this memory of watching him come down the stairs at our home. But other than that, I don't have... They were not here when we were here.

Melinda: It would be an interesting history to know what brought them here.

Helen: Yes, it would, and I don't know that.

Melinda: So you had spent idyllic summers here.

Helen: Oh, yes. Just loved it. We had the best time, and there were so many people. I thought I was looking at something else there. A friend I had, actually, it turned out, when I went to college that there were four other people at college from Ocean Grove.

Melinda: My goodness. What a small world.

Helen: Yes.

Melinda: Where did you go to college?

Helen: Skidmore. [M: Okay.] And one of my good friends had a tent around, and another one had another tent. And then there was another woman, another girl. There were only two of us in the same grade. They were different grade, different years, but there were five of us, which was kind of amazing.

Melinda: So what's so fascinating to me is that The DNA of Ocean Grove travels now to your children, your grandchildren. [H: Yes] Started well over 100 years ago.

Helen: Right. And it will go on because my children and grandchildren want this house. [M: Okay.] So I am in the process of trying to figure out how to do that legally. So they do have it. But I... would like my three remaining children to be the beneficiaries. My two grandchildren in Virginia, their mother died.

Melinda: That's your daughter?

Helen: Yes.

Melinda: I'm sorry.

Helen: They would like to be here. I think their mother loved it. And so they came up as children. And they love it. They would… the oldest one who's coming tonight they would like to be partners in it and they could afford it because they're both doing very well but the other daughter Elizabeth's sister loves it too but she has to compromise with her husband, who's always gone to a lake in Virginia.

Melinda: That happens.

Helen: And so she doesn't get here as much as she'd like to. And it's a hike. It's almost four hours for them. And with two little ones, that's not easy.

Melinda: So you've created a whole other experience of summer camp.

Helen: Yeah, I have. And my other daughter... Her daughter is in Detroit. She's been here twice during the winter, and she's coming again in July. She loves it here. And her husband loves it here too, which is good. When she has a child, when they get married and she has a child, they're probably one who will be definitely bringing that baby here.

Melinda: Lots of roots, deep roots.

Helen: Yes, there are.

Melinda: So as we wind up, what brings you joy about Ocean Grove now?

Helen: I think it's basically the friendships I've made. [M: Mm-hmm] There are a group of us that have breakfast every Friday morning. It's that, plus I can walk everywhere. It's a perfect location. Even when it gets to the point I can't walk that well, I know I can walk with a walker. or I'll get somebody to walk with me, or push me if need be, but still I can get around. It's not like I wouldn't be able to do that in Chatham so well. You can't go up and down streets like you can here. And also, I love just sitting on the porch and talking to people going up and down. This is a great joy. I took yoga for many years. And one of the things the one woman would say to us was, OK, now I want you to close your eyes and envision a place that you are really happy, that you love. And I would envision sitting on the porch. Because in nice weather, it is just, to me, it's delightful. I watch all the people, all the dogs. And you know a lot of them. And it's comforting.

Melinda: You have a big community around you.

Helen: Yes. It's really joyful. No matter what condition you're in, you can find a place to see people. I don't think that happens in suburbs as well.

Melinda: I think that you're right. I mean, you could sit on the porch, but people are driving everywhere. [M: Mm-hmm.] They're not walking as much.

Melinda: That's a nice place to end. Thank you.

Helen: You're welcome.